1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Talk about today's strip, or anything about the comic in general. You can also talk about any of the characters... but don't expect a response. They're FICTIONAL, you guys... sheesh. :)
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1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by Batman1016 » Tue Jan 29, 2019 6:18 am

So, I LOVE The Orville, and I ALSO LOVE Star Trek: Discovery. Just want that made clear up front.

Why do Orville fans think The Orville is more Trek than current Start Trek?

Oh Mr. Dean . . . really? You said it outright and didn't even get you were saying it?

It's because . . . and I know this is gonna just BLOW YOUR MIND . . . .

. . . It has the pacing and overall feel of a '90s UPN show (which Star Trek WAS), half the plotlines from existing Star Trek episodes or other sci-fi shows of the past 15 years (which Star Trek ALWAYS has), it literally offers nothing new of substance (which Trek, arguably, hasn't since DS9 ended), and it's occasionally funny (which, to be fair, so is Trek).

In short . . . The Orville is more than an homage, it is a straight, almost wholesale duplication of the Golden Age of Trek, when it had the most fans and the most financial clout and the most merchandise and the most shows on the air simultaneously and the most rapid-release of films and the most just overall general audience goodwill and recognition and success.

By contrast, current Star Trek is also trying to capture the success of previous television ventures. Just that they're not Trek ventures, but rather Game of Thrones and The Expanse and Killjoys and Firefly and Fringe and other gritty, dark, paranoid, "world at war" action series.

And don't get me wrong, Discovery is actually a MUCH better show than a lot of Orville fans are giving it credit for. As I said, I love BOTH. But the truth of the matter is, if you're looking for a show that delivers on the original Roddenberry vision of "thinking man's sci-fi that touches on important, topical, social issues while offering an optimistic, bright view of humanity's future" . . . be honest. One show delivers EXACTLY that, and one is a Tolkien-esque action drama about humans versus space orcs. How many episodes of Discovery addressed transgender politics and forced sexual "corrective" surgery, social media prevalence and toxicity, porn addiction, climate change denial, date rape, or any other modern societal problems? (Other than religious extremism, which BOTH have addressed, though Discovery has been far more subtle about it.)

As renowned comicbook and sci-fi author (and notably prolific Star Trek novelist) Peter David said it, "The Orville, with very few changes, could easily be a Star Trek series. Discovery, with very few changes, could easily NOT be a Star Trek series." And again, I love them both (as Mr. David has come to as well), but the reasons behind the fandom dissonance? It's pretty obvious.

NOTE: For the record, this is NOT me "getting mad" on social media. On the contrary, I'm more surprised than anything, and wanted to 'splain for anyone else that might be as confused as the author. :)

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by Deacon » Tue Jan 29, 2019 7:21 am

*like*
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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by raptor9k » Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:23 pm

Also, our generation is apparently doomed to endlessly repeat the past concerning all things entertainment.
I'm putting my talents and skills to use for a business so that I receive compensatory funds that I may then choose to spend and invest and save as I see fit. If I choose to blow it all on hookers and Dr. Seuss books, I don't see how that means you owe me a comfortable retirement. - Deacon

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by Rorschach » Tue Jan 29, 2019 6:07 pm

raptor9k wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:23 pm
Also, our generation is apparently doomed to endlessly repeat the past concerning all things entertainment.
To Let

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by Deacon » Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:08 pm

Rorschach wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 6:07 pm
Also, our generation is apparently doomed to endlessly repeat the past concerning all things entertainment.
The follies which a man regrets the most in his life are those which he didn't commit when he had the opportunity. - Helen Rowland, A Guide to Men, 1922

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by terminal2k » Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:30 am

Batman1016 wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 6:18 am
"The Orville, with very few changes, could easily be a Star Trek series. Discovery, with very few changes, could easily NOT be a Star Trek series."
I love that explanation.

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by werefrog » Thu Jan 31, 2019 2:01 am

The Werefrog won't watch Discovery because it requires paying for a subscription to yet another streaming service. The Werefrog hate that model and won't support it. However, if one doesn't mind that model and will support it, go ahead and enjoy Star Trek Discovery if you can: doesn't matter to The Werefrog.

The Werefrog enjoy the Orville, and view it like a Star Trek homage comedy. It is more Star Trek than it is Babylon 5 or Star Wars. It satisfies the feeling of watching Star Trek. The Werefrog have found their handling of the issues that arise to be rather neat. The transgender issue, in which the traditionalist was the one for the sex change surgery while the progressive view was to block it was an interesting twist. The appeal to Rudolph was entirely unexpected.

The Werefrog understand brand loyalty. The Orville is not a Star Trek. It doesn't purport to be such. Star Trek Discovery is, however, Star Trek. It says so right there in the name. The Werefrog don't like some of the choices that were advertised to have been made, but once again, since The Werefrog don't and probably won't watch it, The Werefrog don't particularly care.
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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by nosystemd » Thu Jan 31, 2019 3:29 am

I'm still reeling from the video where Patricia Tallman talks about how B5 sued Trek over stealing the show before B5 first went on the air. Stuff I never knew (I used to own all five seasons-- joke all you like, I'm a fan of Spaced and Simon Pegg as well.)

I did like DS9 (after Sisko shaved his hair off) and I love Trek (met Marina Sirtis too) And I loved Doctor Who (Baker and Eccleston and Tennant and Smith) and they all rip each other off. Is it fair to say Trek is the most shameless among them or not?

But without a television or Netflix, my only connection to Star Trek these days is in fact-- Real Life Comics. I'm so out of touch now, that if there is a Star Trek after Enterprise (Discovery?) I literally only know it exists because of the comic strip archives. That's how much I've kept up with TV, I haven't watched more than 5 DW episodes since Capaldi took over. Don't know what Orville is either-- I'll look it up right now. ...SETH MACFARLANE? Alright, obviously Tony's remote has something to do with this. That's the only thing that explains it.

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by Greg Dean » Fri Feb 01, 2019 7:18 am

As weird as it sounds that MacFarlane is involved, it actually makes a lot of sense. First, he's a HUGE Trekkie. I think at one point he even lobbied to work on a new official Trek show. But he's also done some other stuff that's great - he's pretty much single-handedly responsible for the new Cosmos with Neil DeGrasse Tyson being made. And really, if more of his comedy filtered into the actual SHOW, it would be fantastic, in my books. I think he's a legitimately funny guy.

Unfortunately, the show feels hamstrung, and I'm not sure by WHOM. It approaches funny (and occasionally it hits my funny bone in just the right way), but mostly it just feels like they're playing Star Trek dress-up. Which is a bummer for me.

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by I like pie » Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:42 pm

raptor9k wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:23 pm
Also, our generation is apparently doomed to endlessly repeat the past concerning all things entertainment.
That's hardly new to our generation. If anything, our generation is repeating the repetition of other generations. :lol:

All entertainment is cyclical, and everything's a rehash of something else. Some things are just more direct about it.
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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by Deacon » Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:14 am

Greg, I don’t know if you listen to WTF, but there was a good interview with Seth on it recently. He does talk about the project. It sounded like he was minding his manners for the lost part, but it does at least help shed light on his approach.

Web: http://www.wtfpod.com/podcast/episode-9 ... macfarlane

iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/wtf ... 0426926657
The follies which a man regrets the most in his life are those which he didn't commit when he had the opportunity. - Helen Rowland, A Guide to Men, 1922

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by Greg Dean » Mon Feb 04, 2019 4:41 am

Awesome - I'll pull that down and give it a listen once I'm done with this book.

And to be honest - the last episode with Isaac was probably the best of the series so far. THAT was what The Orville should be.

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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by FirebirdNC » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:48 am

Greg Dean wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 4:41 am
Awesome - I'll pull that down and give it a listen once I'm done with this book.

And to be honest - the last episode with Isaac was probably the best of the series so far. THAT was what The Orville should be.
It was quite good and I bet Norm Macdonald was thrilled to get some screen time haha.
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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by werefrog » Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:26 pm

I like pie wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:42 pm
raptor9k wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:23 pm
Also, our generation is apparently doomed to endlessly repeat the past concerning all things entertainment.
That's hardly new to our generation. If anything, our generation is repeating the repetition of other generations. :lol:

All entertainment is cyclical, and everything's a rehash of something else. Some things are just more direct about it.
So, what you're saying is, "Simpson did it."
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Re: 1-28-19: Orville V. Trek

Post by raptor9k » Mon Feb 04, 2019 2:14 pm

I like pie wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:42 pm
That's hardly new to our generation. If anything, our generation is repeating the repetition of other generations. :lol:

All entertainment is cyclical, and everything's a rehash of something else. Some things are just more direct about it.
I get that entertainment is cyclical and it's all been done before. I was mainly referring to the endless stream of blatant remakes/reboots of the same old IP. Sure, most John Wayne movies are just the same movie with different names applied to the characters. But most of the stuff we get these days is the same story/characters but with a different director's edits.
I'm putting my talents and skills to use for a business so that I receive compensatory funds that I may then choose to spend and invest and save as I see fit. If I choose to blow it all on hookers and Dr. Seuss books, I don't see how that means you owe me a comfortable retirement. - Deacon

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